tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post8089797694162934232..comments2023-10-02T06:59:48.447-04:00Comments on faithmaps blog: The Coast-to-Coast 2007 Multi-Site Conference: Day 1Stephenhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10238745383108764223noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-11544728089771421862007-03-11T23:13:00.000-04:002007-03-11T23:13:00.000-04:00joe (groover), thanks for your comments!Noel and d...joe (groover), thanks for your comments!<BR/><BR/>Noel and dj - I loved hanging with you guys as well!Stephenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10238745383108764223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-39098852859942336702007-03-11T23:12:00.000-04:002007-03-11T23:12:00.000-04:00dan, sorry i'm late with a response here! I belie...dan, sorry i'm late with a response here! I believe that everyone one must find their church within a church. That is why I resonated with this particular phrase from the speaker. If you don't find the one, the three, the 7 and the 12 folks within which you become relationally wedded, then you aren't a part of the church. <BR/><BR/>blessings,Stephenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10238745383108764223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-66293280529268007302007-02-07T17:27:00.000-05:002007-02-07T17:27:00.000-05:00Stephen, great to hang out with you, and I like yo...Stephen, great to hang out with you, and I like your meditation and notes.. in the end, aside from the immediacy of live-blogging, well-written notes (and concept papers) are much easier to read and have longer shelf life :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-35850942130541731562007-02-07T17:04:00.000-05:002007-02-07T17:04:00.000-05:00Don't forget flying for 15 hours, Dan. It was wor...Don't forget flying for 15 hours, Dan. It was worth flying for 15 hours.Noel Heikkinenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02356159374182300443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-80526864581209296482007-02-07T16:52:00.000-05:002007-02-07T16:52:00.000-05:00"Leaders like it big but church folks like it smal..."Leaders like it big but church folks like it small."<br /><br />I guess this sentence seems like it contridicts itself in my mind. There are plenty of small churches in the US, but it sure seems like a lot of people go to large churches. That in in itself means a lot of "church folk" like a large church. <br /><br />I know that with our church about 50% of our people were previsouly unchurched. They like coming to our meeting, seeing what we believe and what we value and being able to remain annonymous until they are ready to decide to pursue more intimate community.<br /><br />What are your thoughts on this?<br /><br />Hey nice meeting you the on tuesday too! I know Noel said that talking with you was worth the price of admission.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-18127233208836391452007-02-06T21:48:00.000-05:002007-02-06T21:48:00.000-05:00Brad...thanks for the Ray Vander Laan name. I lik...Brad...thanks for the Ray Vander Laan name. I liked what I saw on his site; http://www.followtherabbi.com<br /><br />These are good words:<br />For us to know Jesus—and thus God the Father and the Holy Spirit—more intimately, we must carefully assess our 21st-century culture and Western attitudes in relation to and in light of the 1st-century world of Jesus. We must immerse ourselves in the culture of Scripture and Jesus of Nazareth. And we must learn to "think Hebrew"—in the way that the original writers of the Text thought.<br /><br />I see much of our church culture like the frog in water...being boiled to death and not even aware!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-59211081018349221992007-02-06T19:28:00.000-05:002007-02-06T19:28:00.000-05:00hi groover,
thanks for your clarification. i rea...hi groover,<br /><br />thanks for your clarification. i really find myself agreeing with you in regards to hebrew vs greek or eastern vs western/euro-centric style 'teaching'. <br /><br />are you familiar with ray Vander Laan? he speaks extensively about this as well as living his life in this discipleship model (hebrew). also, john eldridge writes from an extremely practical point of view in regards to initiating men through deep relationship with someone who has actually walked the walk before them.<br /><br />i believe that these two men are really pressing forward in this field, with a loud call to followers of Jesus. <br /><br />also, i believe stephen has blogged a little about his extensive experience in his local church in trying to implement a relational/mentor format.<br /><br />thanks groover for your response:)<br /><br />bradbradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13291016360170886039noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-51415422708526544362007-02-06T18:51:00.000-05:002007-02-06T18:51:00.000-05:00Hi Brad
Excellent point...I can only share from my...Hi Brad<br />Excellent point...I can only share from my experience. <br /><br />From ages 20-25 I was in a mega church (10,000 people on Sunday)<br /><br />Ages 25-28 (out of my home state) a smaller church and then a very small church (88 people)<br /><br />Ages 29-34 church size 600 then it split. Back to the mega church of my college years.<br /><br />Ages 34-38 no steady church attendance<br /><br />Ages 39-42 size about 1,200<br /><br />In all of this, yes, without a doubt, there was very poor training outside of the teaching format. As for training, I mean in the most Hebrew of ways. I feel the church has bought the Greek model of learning found in most school systems, that is to deposit information in audible format (sermon). <br /><br />There has been very little actual training similar to the father-son model or discipleship model of Jesus and/or the older man investing in the younger man for a period of time.<br /><br />It's just not done which raises many more questions and brings me full circle to leadership which assumes purpose and understanding of foundations. <br /><br />How can you lead someone where you haven't gone? Too many leaders have head knowledge and too little life understanding that reflects a biblical world & life view, which translates to the practical areas of life--relationships, finances, investing, art, ect.<br /><br />I just see too many who can break down the notes (teach, give sermons) but don't really play the instrument well themselves...but are in a position to tell others how to play.<br /><br />Doesn't make any sense.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-5632571287518384182007-02-06T16:45:00.000-05:002007-02-06T16:45:00.000-05:00hi groover,
you said..."Like always, the core iss...hi groover,<br /><br />you said..."Like always, the core issue is that of leadership--and in this case, I am referring to one man being able to train up another in the ways of Christ. IMO, the church has utterly failed in this area."<br /><br />...is this in reference to the 'mega-church' model alone? i'm just asking for clarification as i'm not certain of how specific or general your statement is meant to be. i believe any model, be it mega-church, multi-site, home church, etc., can excel or neglect what i'll call healthy discipelship or 'train(ing) up a man'.<br /><br />i appreciate your thoughts in regards to 'small group' and the church.<br /><br />hey stephen, just curious if it's warm there. thanks for keeping us updated on the conference.<br /><br />bradbradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13291016360170886039noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3591706.post-37259257639073354302007-02-06T14:48:00.000-05:002007-02-06T14:48:00.000-05:00Groover here:
I spent most of my Christian experi...Groover here:<br /><br />I spent most of my Christian experience since college in the "mega church" (10,000) people on Sunday.<br /><br />There is no "mega church." There is one place where people gather, but the "church" is the weekly small group. People fall into groups; married, single, college, high school, seniors, etc. <br /><br />In my church, there was strong bible teaching. However, there was very poor discipleship/ mentoring (call it what you like). I almost never socialized with those outside the college department. In this world, "church" was simply (18-24yo's)...which is a very isolated world & life view. <br /><br />The issue of driving is important. It is very difficult to cultivate any type of meaningful relationships when those in your "small group" live 10-50 miles away from each other. <br /><br />Like always, the core issue is that of leadership--and in this case, I am referring to one man being able to train up another in the ways of Christ. IMO, the church has utterly failed in this area. Leadership must be more than one man being able to explain what a particular passage means. It's sad the world seems to have more wisdom here than those who claim to model themself after the Lord Jesus.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com